Caretta ID?

[Lawrence Hayes]

Hi All,
We've had a Caretta hanging on the wall for several years and are considering selling it. (Well, we ARE going to sell it)
I'd like to be able to ID what year it is but don't know where to start.
It looks like it had two engines as there were chain tension adjusters on each side of the seat mount.
I had to replace the rear axle tube and seat tube also as they were complete junk. (I run a shop preparing and fabing. vintage race cars so it wasn't an issue)
It appears to have had the disc brake conversion at some point but the welds look the same as the original ones on the rest of the kart so maybe they took it to I-B for the mod?
There's also a bracket that is a mystery to me. I included a couple of pics of it. It's located just to the rear of the master cylinder braket.
I'm having the chrome on the pedals, spindles, and tank redone; reapinting the frame and will have seat cover made.
I'm sure I'll have lots of questions for you all.
Thanks!
Lawrence

[Michael Burke]

Here's a couple of photos from the Harm Schuman collection. It has the same odd bracket as your chassis. I don't know if the kart has been sold. Is this the frame you started with?

[Lawrence Hayes]

That looks pretty identical to what we have, although I don't know when that collection was sold we purchased the chassis here in the early 2000's, about 2002. (Spokane, WA)
I see on the photo what looks to be the remnants of the bracket for the original drum type brake.
What do you think?

Lawrence

[Tom Smith]

the mount is for the original drum brakes linkage

[Michael Burke]

Hi Tom,

Do you have any photos showing the bellcrank there? The only photos I can find of the bellcrank equipped karts show them being mounted on a short tube similar to how the pedals are mounted. In his frame photos there appears to be the small remains of a tab that would have guided the brake rod to the rear as if might have had a Comet brake. The old tab spot is just behind that tower bracket. The karts I've seen with the bellcrank mounts have a mount on each side of the frame so the rod can be redirected to the rear after crossing the frame.

thanks

Michael

[Tom Smith]

I've seen the same mystery bracket on other Carettas. If it isn't for the brake linkage then I don't have a clue what it was for. It looks like a fairly large hole in the top plate on the bracket.
What I haven't seen or remember seeing is a rear steer early Caretta sprint so I'm wondering if it's original or a back yard hacked engineering job on Harm's rig?

[Lawrence Hayes]

The welds on the mystery bracket look like they happened at a different point in time since they appear to be gas welds rather than stick like the rest of the chassis, but they are high quality.
Is there any chance they had the brakect to hold an 'off' switch? The hole is about the right size.

I just striped the side panels of their paint and they were black on top of the Fly Yellow original. As the old finishes came off a couple of pencil lines appeared. Maybe they used as a guide for stamping the louvers: one line was drawn in the ground plane and the other in the upper side bar plane. Guess they decided on the ground plane.

I also had another look at the 'Harms' chassis pictures and noticed that on the RH panel lowere row of rivets two are screws. Those two holes on our chassis have threads in them...old rusty threads but threads none-the-less

Lawrence

[Dan Flanders]

Hi Lawrence-
It is definitely remnants of the brake system not an off switch. Take a look at the attached picture and you'll see the pivots they used to route the brake linkage across the chassis to the off side. I played around with the pivots when I was there, but couldn't visualize how the hell they set it up. Of course it being IB, they probably have some totally ingenious set up.
Your kart is pretty interesting, it appears to be an '61 or earlier kart retrofit to '62 and later specs. The '61 and earlier karts generally had the motor mount welded to the axle tube, ran the 4" drum brake and had an open steering shaft. The '62 and later karts ran a two piece bolt on motor mount, hydraulic brakes and the steering tube was enclosed like the axle. Of course, these are general observations as ANYTHING is possible with IB.

I hope you have all the Caretta specific parts as replacements for the pinned drive and brake set ups are non-existent. Maybe you sweet talk Michael into sharing the specs, it sounds like you've got the skills and equipment to do it yourself unlike a backyard butcher like myself. If you don't have the original rims, you should be aware that the taper of the pin drive mounts are different between the first generation Go-Powers rims (convex) and the second generation (concave) rims, they are not interchangeable. Also, the modern reproduction rims must be modified to fit the stubby little spindles, I think I had to have the bearing pockets recessed an additional 1/2" on either side to get enough length.

Also, double check the fit of the brake caliper. Mine was original, but cut to match an earlier variant of the Hurst Airheart 150 series caliper, 10 minutes with a die-grinder fixed it.
Dan

Caretta_Pivots1.jpg

(210.89 KiB) Not downloaded yet

[Rob Voska]

Was that for a dead axle kart?

[Dominic Salvato]

Hi Lawrence, I told members about this kart back in December 2007. Hayes's Cages in Spokane. Lawrence can make any part needed for a Caretta. He made me a perfect set of pin drive hubs back then.